DIY LED build

[Tom@HaslettMI]

After several years of lurking, learning, and planning I have finally begun the process of building a DIY LED array. So far all I have are the heatsinks. I hope to order the rest of the gear sometime in the coming months (as the wallet allows). I plan to purchase the LEDs and thermal pads from rapidled and the two drivers, either Thomas Research or Inventronics (supposedly the same driver with a different brand name), from either nanotuners or LEDgroupbuy (http://www.ledgroupbuy.com/).

The layout... (close up of one side)

http://i137.photobucket.com/albums/q234/tomalwin/AlwinLED23x4-1.jpg

Additional details...

One driver run 15 royal blues and the other drive 8 neutral whites (yellow), 2 cool white (white), and the remaining 5 royal blues (see pics).

This will be run along with 2 T5HO bulbs (Blue+ and Fiji Purple) slightly over driven by an IceCap 430.

May run on a 50 breeder for a bit but hopefully I'll have switched over to a 75 gallon before the LED build is complete.


Potential add-ons

I may eventually get the Digital Aquatics ALC unit to dim the LEDS. The research I've done suggests it can dim these drivers.


I will add to this post as I progress, but be forewarned it will be a slow process! I'm open to suggestions, constructive criticism, and compliments!

Thanks for looking,
Tom

[MizTanks]

Let me be the first to compliment you Tom on the great picture lol and wish you the best on your building adventure :) I'll def be following along mostly cause I know I can look forward to some hardy humor ;)

[jstan]

Looks like your off to a good start Tom. I was gonna buy a kit from aquastyle online myself. However I ended up purchasing the LEDs, heatsink, and thermal pads from rapid led just a few minutes ago. I debated on the thermal pads for a day or so, and decided wth let's give em a try. I ended up getting the TRC driver from nanotuners though(never heard of the other driver before), and the meanwell just looked to confusing to figure out the first time around.
If you'd like I'll let you know how the pads work out. Or if you're coming to the A2 swap stop by my table, I'll be using my led build there. Just have to figure out how to mount all of it into my aquatic life t5 fixture.

[XSiVE]

Good luck with this, looks like you're off to a good start!

The only issue I can see with your plan is that you're not going to have very good control over the overall color at the end of the day since you're combining strings of blues and whites together on drivers.

Do you think that you will have enough light for the 75 with only 30 total LEDs? -I guess it depends on what you plan on keeping, and where though.

[Tom@HaslettMI]

Thanks for the kind words all.

Miz - Hopefully I can maintain a sense of humor about this build. If I drop $300+ and it goes south this thread will end up being a string of profanities.


If you'd like I'll let you know how the pads work out. Or if you're coming to the A2 swap stop by my table, I'll be using my led build there. Just have to figure out how to mount all of it into my aquatic life t5 fixture.

I can't make the swap but please keep me posted on your build and how the pads work.


The only issue I can see with your plan is that you're not going to have very good control over the overall color at the end of the day since you're combining strings of blues and whites together on drivers.

Do you think that you will have enough light for the 75 with only 30 total LEDs? -I guess it depends on what you plan on keeping, and where though.

I hear you on the color control. I'm hoping that with one 100% blue string I'll at least be able to keep it from being too blue... we shall see.

30 LEDs alone will not be enough. There will be another 30 added at a later date. Until then 2 48" T5HO bulbs (slightly overdriven by an IceCap 430) will provide additional light. If need be I will use the T5s to change overall color.

Tom

[SaltyDog]

Hi Tom,

LED placement looks pretty good.Are you already using the RKL?

[Tom@HaslettMI]

Hi Tom,

LED placement looks pretty good.Are you already using the RKL?

Thanks for the feedback. Yes, I already have the RKL; however, I do not have the ALC module. My plan is to initially run the LEDs with linear pots and add the ALC when I can afford it (once the kids are out of daycare may be?:big_grin:)

I'm intrigued with the DIY controller you have in your thread. You wouldn't happen to know how to DIY an ALC module and have it run by the RKL would you?

Tom

[SaltyDog]

Let me goto their website and look at the specs for the output signal.....if it's a 0-5v output it'd be a simple design to DIY in a small radioshack project box....


Update from a fellow reefer:

The output of the RKL ACL module is a bit weak and not really designed for LED Drivers. To be honest it may work fine but would not be surprised if it does not. I dont recommend controlling more than one or two drivers.

[Tom@HaslettMI]

The output of the RKL ACL module is a bit weak and not really designed for LED Drivers. To be honest it may work fine but would not be surprised if it does not. I dont recommend controlling more than one or two drivers.

My understanding is that the ALC will only dim 2 drivers. Therefore, I was planning/dreading to eventually buy 2 ALC modules. Would it be possible to build a module capable of controlling 4 (or more) drivers via the RKL? if so, how hard would it be for someone who has minimal electronics experience to build, and what would you estimate the cost of parts for such a project?

Thanks for all of the help and information,
Tom

[SaltyDog]

Well I just finished chatting with Bill from ReefLEDlights and they are actually working on a driver themselves but for the APEX....I kinda read it wrong in a way and thought it'd be available for the RKL also but no go there.Yeah the $80 price tage for each one is kinda harsh IMO and only being able to control 2-channels even if that.

[Tom@HaslettMI]

I just ordered the rest of the equipment (drivers, LEDs, pots, fans, ect.) I need for this build from LEDGroupBuy.com (http://www.ledgroupbuy.com/). I am excited to get this project moving! I went with 3-up LEDs (one Cree neutral white and 2 royal blue emitters per star). Looks like I need to start tinning some wire... I'll keep you posted.

Tom

[ReefWerks]

I just ordered the rest of the equipment (drivers, LEDs, pots, fans, ect.) I need for this build from LEDGroupBuy.com (http://www.ledgroupbuy.com/). I am excited to get this project moving! I went with 3-up LEDs (one Cree neutral white and 2 royal blue emitters per star). Looks like I need to start tinning some wire... I'll keep you posted.

Tom

Which drivers did you end up with? Not all of theirs are dimmable or compatible...Just from experience with customers who used them...

[creefer]

Congrats.....will be following this for sure.

[Tom@HaslettMI]

Which drivers did you end up with? Not all of theirs are dimmable or compatible...Just from experience with customers who used them...

I selected the Inventronics 40 watt 700 Ma model (http://www.ledgroupbuy.com/inventronics-40w-driver-700ma/). They will run 15 LEDs each and should be dimmable with either pots or the Digital Aquatics ALC (If I ever buy one). I did lots of research on this... so hopefully I didn't screw up.

Tom

[creefer]

I'm interested to follow. The 3-up thing is pretty interesting.

[ReefWerks]

I selected the Inventronics 40 watt 700 Ma model (http://www.ledgroupbuy.com/inventronics-40w-driver-700ma/). They will run 15 LEDs each and should be dimmable with either pots or the Digital Aquatics ALC (If I ever buy one). I did lots of research on this... so hopefully I didn't screw up.

Tom


Good choice, they will run with DA units very well!

[Tom Toro]

I'll be paying attention to your build, Tom. I'm waiting for two kits now from Aquastyle. I hear their drivers are terrible so glad to hear we can mix and match.

Nice thread!

[creefer]

Good choice, they will run with DA units very well!

Thanks for the helpful information.

[Tom@HaslettMI]

My ledgroupbuy.com (http://www.ledgroupbuy.com/) order shipped today! It seems like it took forever for the 3-ups to come in. I'm excited to get this project moving.

Stay tuned for updates!

Tom

[ReefTech]

hey tom, i got some par readings on my led fixtures all thanks to jeff at reef solutions for allowing me to bring the fixture in and use is par meter. here they are......

light hanging 10" above water

-350 @ 1" under water
-185 @ 6"under water
-110 @ 12" under water with a 24"inch spread from side to side plus full coverage from front to back in the tank. again this was just one of my fixtures that was tested and they didnt have any deep tanks to get deeper readings. jeff and a customer at the store were really inpressed by how much coverage the fixture had. as the pictures show we also went with the disks with 3 leds on it the only thing i want to mention is the drivers your planning one using. the paper work that came with our leds recommended using a 1000mA driver to drive the leds and i noticed you said you were using something like 750 or 760mA drivers. so you might want to watch that cause these leds are very powerful. our power units get pretty warm cause the lights are pulling a good amount of power. again just wanted to pass that along cause i would hate to see something happen to your build.

[Tom@HaslettMI]

Very nice. Thank you for getting the data and posting it.



...the only thing i want to mention is the drivers your planning one using. the paper work that came with our leds recommended using a 1000mA driver to drive the leds and i noticed you said you were using something like 750 or 760mA drivers. so you might want to watch that cause these leds are very powerful. our power units get pretty warm cause the lights are pulling a good amount of power. again just wanted to pass that along cause i would hate to see something happen to your build.

Thank you for the warning. I'm a bit confused though... wouldn't a 1000mA driver push the LEDs harder and result in more heat and slightly shorter LED life? I could be all wrong about this but I think the 700mA driver will produce less heat and less PAR. I will post PAR values once the arrays are build and hung.

UPDATE: The hood is in the process of being modified to receive the heat sinks! Also the LEDs, drivers, pots, and adhesive pads should be arriving tomorrow.

Tom

[Tom@HaslettMI]

LEDs arrived the other day! So far I've tinned all of the stars and laid out how they'll be arranged up on the heat sinks.

I also did a little wiring and may have the lighting system for my 2012 nano contest (http://www.captivereefs.com/forum/nano-contest/tom-haslettmis-2012-pico-19696/) entry figured out. I just need to get a few PAR measurements and construct the housing.

Tom

[MizTanks]

Tom I'm so happy for me that knowing eventually you'll be posting some pics to go along with this build-it's like WTH are you all talking about-LOL

[Tom@HaslettMI]

Tom I'm so happy for me that knowing eventually you'll be posting some pics to go along with this build-it's like WTH are you all talking about-LOL

Thanks for the reality check! Here are the 3up stars.

http://i137.photobucket.com/albums/q234/tomalwin/IMAG0896.jpg

The "star" is the white hexagon thing and the 3up refers to the three LED emitters per star. The emitter combo on each star is 1 CREE XP-G neutral white (green square) and 2 CREE XT-E royal blue (silver/clear squares). Tinning is the addition of solder to the pads located on the star. The pads are where the wires are connected to the pad.

Oh and the layout of the stars on the heat sink has changed. Initially I was planning to get to get 30 stars, each with a single emitter. But I changed my mind as I was making the online purchase and got 10 3ups instead. So, image the pic in the first post with 5 stars rather than 15.

I hope this makes sense... :hypnotized: If not let me know and I'll do my best answer any questions.

Tom

[MizTanks]

Makes perfect sense! Thank you for explaining. I'm going to learn much from this build. Way cool for me! :)

[chazde3]

Tom, I'm going to have to check out your build sometime. I'm planning a rebuild of my 75g's fixture soon plus possibly a small build for my contest pico.

[laversace]

-350 @ 1" under water
-185 @ 6"under water
-110 @ 12" under water

What was the mA setting on your driver to achieve these results? Thanks

[ReefTech]

my fixture has three buck block drivers in it. each one is 1000mA theres 2 leds wired to each driver

[ajmckay]

Hey Tom, how is the build going? Are you really only using 10 of these 3up stars for your whole build?

And lave, are those PAR numbers using the 3up stars? @ what current?

[laversace]

Similarly to Tom I am also in the process of building a LED setup with the Cree 3up disk for my 36X18X18 rimless glass tank. I am not new to the reef hobby but pretty new to LED light options.

I spoke with a person over at LED Group Buy and he recommended 14 of the Cree 3up (evenly spaced across the heatsink),8 turquoise and 6 deep red exotic LED's to make the rest of the coral color spectrum "pop".


My question to the group and I apologize if my questions seem elementary to you all but:
1. What is the scheme for calculating the optics angels versus height of the LED fixture off the surface of the water?
2. What is the optimal PAR reading for corals and how would I measure the PAR reading at the bottom of my 18" deep tank?
3. My electronic background is limited but what I can remember from college physics is that if you run the LED's at maximum output at 1000mA would you increase the operating temperature and thus reduce life expectancy of the LED's?
4. Then should I run the driver at around 350 -400 mA as recommended by Cree?

Sorry but the LED industry is still trying to get standardized and I am confused as ****.

My initial questions were for Reeftech and his PAR numbers.

Thanks in advance for any insights you may provide.

Laversace

[ajmckay]

Overall I think that 14 of these 3up LEDs should be quite adequate for our 36x18 tanks...
check out this thread: http://www.nano-reef.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=271055&st=0.

Here a guy basically makes his own "3up clusters" with the same LEDs as the 3up, but as individual LEDs. The turquoise and red are nice additions, ones that I was considering as well as maybe a few UV's, true violets, or both.

Regarding your questions, I'm not an expert either by any means but from what I gather:
1) Geometry! Here's my formula (http://www.nano-reef.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=184000&view=findpost&p=2027811). Many people make models in google sketchup and the like because you can draw angles and just move them around. The formula I posted is to get a diameter circle which you can then create in paint or something and move around.

2) The optimal PAR depends on the types of corals you have/want and where they will be situated. PAR drops as depth increases. So if you want to keep a coral that does best with at least 200PAR on or near the sand then you would need to test your LEDs. Optics help achieve higher PAR at depth. To test PAR you need a meter which is pretty expensive. If someone finds actual PAR data on these LEDs then they should post it...

3) The maximum output of the LEDs is specified in the data sheet. As long as you have adequate heatsinking you can run an LED at maximum current or higher and not suffer a decrease in LED life (or at least not a significant one).

4) So you can really run the LEDs at whatever current you want up to the maximum with no negative effects as long as your thermal management is sufficient. It seems like many people set up their systems to be able to draw maximum power if needed, however, it seems that a lot of people usually don't run their LED systems at maximum power and have them dimmed some using potentiometers.

[Tom@HaslettMI]

Hey Tom, how is the build going? Are you really only using 10 of these 3up stars for your whole build?

And lave, are those PAR numbers using the 3up stars? @ what current?

Hi aj,

The build has been built and is running (just a couple hours a day turned down to less than 50%). Yes, the current build is just the 10 3ups (running at 750 mA). My move to LEDs is a gradual one. Mostly due to budget constraints, but also partly as a test to see if I like LEDs. So far I'm liking what I'm seeing. Along with the LEDs I'm also running 2 54 watt T5HOs slightly overdriven by an IceCap 430 (this info is also in the post #1). I'm planning to build a second unit at a later date.

The PAR numbers posted are not mine. However, I've borrowed a PAR meter and have taken a few random readings. The measurements I've taken are a bit lower than ReefTech's... but I'm also not using optics right now. I will do some more through measurements soon and will post the results.

Tom

[ajmckay]

Hey Tom,

You are making a huge mistake... You say that your fixture is up and running, yet there are no pictures of the build or of it over your tank!!!! Actually this is now over your 75g? Is your 75 also 36x18? How is the coverage in this tank? You say you'll build a second fixture, why is that?

Anyways I would love to see some pictures as soon as you get a moment of the build layout, and also of the light over your tank. Some observations would also be helpful as to how it lights overall, if there's enough coverage over the width of the tank (since you used a 4 1/8" heatsink) and suggestions on what could be done to improve the fixture.

I'm in the process of designing an LED build and these 3up LEDs are certainly enticing. Like you, however, I'm on a restricted budget so I'm very interested in how many LEDs this will need to get good coverage over my 40b...

[laversace]

I have decided to purchase 32 of the newest RB and 16 NW from LEDGROUPBUY instead of the 3up.
I am planning to run them at 350mA to balance lumen/nm/PUR output versus LED lifetime due to higher temperature at the higher forward mA. I am planning to use hardware from a computer power supply that has at least 350W capacity as my driver. I will be running the LEDs with multiple dimmers to reduce the power sent to each line of LEDs. Resistors will also be used to limit the forward mA output to a maximum of 350mA. I tested the feasibly of this set up and it operates fine without flicker and metered it as well and the voltage was constant enough to be acceptable for long term use. I'll post pics of the build as I go along and appreciate any comments for improvements from the group. Thanks.

[ajmckay]

laversace, I'm not really following you at all... I'm by no means an electrician, but I would think that setup to be much less efficient than just using a constant current LED driver for each channel...

Anyways, start a build thread!

[Tom@HaslettMI]

Hey Tom,

You are making a huge mistake... You say that your fixture is up and running, yet there are no pictures of the build or of it over your tank!!!! Actually this is now over your 75g? Is your 75 also 36x18? How is the coverage in this tank? You say you'll build a second fixture, why is that?

Anyways I would love to see some pictures as soon as you get a moment of the build layout, and also of the light over your tank. Some observations would also be helpful as to how it lights overall, if there's enough coverage over the width of the tank (since you used a 4 1/8" heatsink) and suggestions on what could be done to improve the fixture.

I'm in the process of designing an LED build and these 3up LEDs are certainly enticing. Like you, however, I'm on a restricted budget so I'm very interested in how many LEDs this will need to get good coverage over my 40b...

A mistake... I hope not. It's more a fact of not enough time to play with the tank. I admit I've been neglecting this thread and I will try to get some photos and additional details posted soon.

Observations: Overall, I like the set up a lot. Currently I don't have optics so the light is not penetrating as well as I'd hoped.

Tom

[ajmckay]

Hehe, I suppose I was being facetious... The problem is that it doesn't come out right in text...

Anyways, whenever you can post some pictures it would be appreciated. I'm not finding much for pictures with these LEDs.

On a side note I'm probably going to do 12 of them driven at 1000mA on my 40br. I'm not sure about optics, but they're a possibility.

[laversace]

Here is a pic of my LED set up that I was finally able to complete.

The specs are below:

1. 54 LED total 36RB / 18NW Cree, drilled Al heat sink to run wires to connector for easy take down maintenance.
2. Using two 350W computer power supply as constant current power source (verifed no fluctuation in current with meter), each power source is running white and blue seperately.
3. An array of resistors to limit the current to 750mA for each of the white and blue power strips. I increased to even 1000mA but I saw diminishing return on noticable lumen increase. This I hope will balance max viewable lumen output versus extended life of LED. Verified LED junction temp to be 75F max.
4. Using two dimmers to adjust voltage for each of the white and blue strips.

Actually the custom cabinetry which I did myself took longer and required more tedious attention to detail then the LED setup.

I am anxious to install the 50B and see how the color combo works. So far I like the warmth of the 2RB:1NW ratio. May add the coral white that was recommended by LEDGROUPBUY.

I'll try to post more pics but so far I'm limited to only one upload and I am new to forums so don't know much how to navigate around it.

Laversace

[laversace]

another photo

[laversace]

my cabinet work

[Tom@HaslettMI]

Here is a pic of my LED set up that I was finally able to complete.

The specs are below:

1. 54 LED total 36RB / 18NW Cree, drilled Al heat sink to run wires to connector for easy take down maintenance.
2. Using two 350W computer power supply as constant current power source (verifed no fluctuation in current with meter), each power source is running white and blue seperately.
3. An array of resistors to limit the current to 750mA for each of the white and blue power strips. I increased to even 1000mA but I saw diminishing return on noticable lumen increase. This I hope will balance max viewable lumen output versus extended life of LED. Verified LED junction temp to be 75F max.
4. Using two dimmers to adjust voltage for each of the white and blue strips.

Actually the custom cabinetry which I did myself took longer and required more tedious attention to detail then the LED setup.

I am anxious to install the 50B and see how the color combo works. So far I like the warmth of the 2RB:1NW ratio. May add the coral white that was recommended by LEDGROUPBUY.

I'll try to post more pics but so far I'm limited to only one upload and I am new to forums so don't know much how to navigate around it.

Laversace

Looks great!

This is my 75 gallon with 2 overdriven T5HOs and 10 3ups (20RB and 10NW).
http://i137.photobucket.com/albums/q234/tomalwin/IMAG0920.jpg

[laversace]

my cabinetry work

[laversace]

Do you think it will be enough light without using your T5s?

[Tom@HaslettMI]

Do you think it will be enough light without using your T5s?

Holy slow response... sorry laversace. The answer is YES! I've been running just the LEDs (w/o optics) for several months and everything is doing great.

Here's a recent shot of the tank with only 30 3watt LEDs...
http://i137.photobucket.com/albums/q234/tomalwin/IMG_5488.jpg

My plan is to pick up optics in the next month or two.

Tom

[MizTanks]

Looks awesome Tom!!

[Tankster]

Holy slow response... sorry laversace. The answer is YES! I've been running just the LEDs (w/o optics) for several months and everything is doing great.

Here's a recent shot of the tank with only 30 3watt LEDs...
http://i137.photobucket.com/albums/q234/tomalwin/IMG_5488.jpg



Where is the BGM?

[jim48442]

man those are some nice big clams my opinion everyone should have some lol wish i had the no how to do my own leds i think optics cause alot of the problems they focus 2 much light in 1 spot and people burn their stuff

[chazde3]

Holy slow response... sorry laversace. The answer is YES! I've been running just the LEDs (w/o optics) for several months and everything is doing great.

Here's a recent shot of the tank with only 30 3watt LEDs...
http://i137.photobucket.com/albums/q234/tomalwin/IMG_5488.jpg

My plan is to pick up optics in the next month or two.

Tom

You only have 30 LEDs over your 75g? Dang, I'm running 52 over my 75g. I have to get over sometime to see your setup, it looks great.

[Tom@HaslettMI]

Looks awesome Tom!!

Thank you Miz. I finally figured out how to use the manual white balance on my point and shoot camera and that has made all the difference in getting good pix with the LEDs.


Where is the BGM?

Left side above the clownfish and below the fan coral. It bleached out when my nitrates hit 100 ppm, but it's recovering quickly. I'll try to get some close up shots of it and post them in my Members Tank thread.

Tom

[Tom@HaslettMI]

man those are some nice big clams my opinion everyone should have some lol wish i had the no how to do my own leds i think optics cause alot of the problems they focus 2 much light in 1 spot and people burn their stuff

Thanks Jim. Clams are my favorite reef critter. I'm planning to add optics in the near future and will hopefully do so without causing any damage.


You only have 30 LEDs over your 75g? Dang, I'm running 52 over my 75g. I have to get over sometime to see your setup, it looks great.

You definitely need to come over and check it out.

What type of CREEs are you running? The difference may be in the lumen:watt ratio. I run XT-Es at 700mA with out optics.

I'm also a little surprised that this amount of light is sufficient. My original plan was to run this build along with 2 T5HOs to see if I liked LEDs, and later build a second identical array to replace the T5s. But when it came time to replace the T5s I couldn't justify spending the money and decided to see if the LEDs alone would work. Now seeing how everything is happy with so few LEDs I've come up with a new plan. I'd like to add some additional spectrum as well as bump the PAR a little higher... so, I'm thinking I'll add five of THESE (http://www.ledgroupbuy.com/ocean-coral-white/) to my existing heatsinks for a total of 45 LEDs. But that won't be for another 6 months or so.

Tom