Apex Question

[mcleodm]

Hey guys,

Got a quick question for you apex experts. I have been trying to setup my auto-water-change program inside my apex and i am stuck.

The way I am doing it right now is i made a v-outlet called 30G-WC. It contains when the water should be changed as well as on if feed d.

My auto-water change system contains 3 steps. Drain the sump, refill the sump, refill the new sw container. So 3 pumps. I have set my return pumps and protein skimmer to be off when 30G-WC is on.

I have got the turning on the physical outlets working, the problem is turning them off. I can time their turning on with defer statements, but there is no way i know of to turn them off after there job is done.

Any ideas or if you have a better way of doing this, then that would be great. Hopefully i didnt write this too confusingly. I am trying to get my tank to near automation by next sunday when i leave for boot camp and my mom takes it over.

THANKS

[jimsflies]

Do you have float switches controlling this or just trying to time it?

[mcleodm]

Going to run it using timers. My sump has 3 sections. There is a float in the middle which prevents the return pumps and skimmer from running if the water level is too low. Only point of error I can think of is if the float switch fails.

[jimsflies]

To me it seems real risky running water changes on timers with no other fail safes. If for some reason one pump fails to turn on or if the flow rates change over time, what happens?

[mcleodm]

Good point. I could use a conductivity probe to ensure that saltwater is being replaced and if anything goes wrong, it will just alert the user. A lot less work then installing floats.

[XSiVE]

I'd just use float switches on the breakout/IO box in conjunction with the timers

[jimsflies]

Is this operation going to be totally unmanned or is your mom going to be there when it is doing its thing?

[mcleodm]

Unmanned. Lets say it changes the water on a monday. She would put the salt in on tuesday and then 13 days later, it would do its thing again.

Seems more logical to use conductivity. You get to monitor it and if something goes wrong with the awc, it will tell you. If you do it with floats, it just tells you something is wrong, no monitoring.

Guess with floats you can pinpoint an individual problem in the system vs with conductivity it just tells you the whole system is offline.

[jimsflies]

I guess maybe another question is what's our budget on this project?

My feeling is, that she should be there to watch it happen and verify that it doesn't overflow the tank or the bucket (or is this going directly in the drain?).

[mcleodm]

The drained sw goes into a 30 gal trash can with a bulkhead near the top. This then goes into a drain.

I am torn between salinity probe or float switches.

In the mean time, do you know of any command that can turn off the pumps when there job is done? This would be using the timer only method.

[mcleodm]

Also, what would you suggest I set my mp40 connected to the apex at?

Currently, my program is:
Fallback Lagoon
Set Lagoon
If Time 09:00 to 10:00 Then Pulse
If Time 10:00 to 12:00 Then ReefCst1
If Time 12:00 to 13:00 Then Pulse
If Time 13:00 to 17:00 Then ReefCst2
If Time 17:00 to 18:00 Then Pulse
If Time 18:00 to 20:00 Then ReefCst1
If Time 20:00 to 23:00 Then Lagoon
If Time 23:00 to 06:00 Then Slow
If Time 06:00 to 09:00 Then Constant
If FeedA 000 Then OFF
If FeedB 000 Then Slow

Profiles:
Lagoon-max int 60%
ReefCst1-max int 70%
ReefCst2-max int 100%
Pulse-2sec max int 100%
Slow-int 25%
Constant-int 65%

I have my lights setup with the sun command +2 hours on sunrise and sunset. Is there a way to program the mp40 to match this? I don't want the pump to be at pulse when the actinics arent even on yet if its like july or something and the lights come on at 7am. (i dont think that would happen, but its just an example)

[jimsflies]

I'm still a little fuzzy on what all you have going...but hate to keep asking questions...so here is a basic program you could put in for your pump outlets:

Fallback OFF
Set OFF
If Outlet 30G-WC = ON Then On


If that doesn't help, I think we need a look at your virtual timer statement and other outlets. You can get a download of your apex program (http://www.reeftronics.net/apex-program) and post it here.

For your vortech, I assume you have the WXM module then? I don't have that one yet, but would like to get it.

[mcleodm]

Yes I have the wxm module. Its pretty neat. certainly worth the money.

Basically, this is what i need to do with sample times inserted.

Pump 1: SWRet-AWC (5_2) needs to be on for 1 minutes. Then

Current program:
Fallback OFF
Set OFF
If Outlet 30G-WC = ON Then ON
Min Time 003:00 Then OFF
Pump 2: SWSend-AWC3 (3_3) needs to be on for 1 minute. Then

Fallback OFF
Set OFF
If Outlet 30G-WC = ON Then ON
Defer 001:00 Then ON
Min Time 002:00 Then OFF
Pump 3: SWFill-AWC2 (3_2) needs to be on for 1 minute.

Fallback OFF
Set OFF
If Outlet 30G-WC = ON Then ON
Defer 002:00 Then ON
Min Time 003:00 Then OFF

30G-WC program (havent put in the timer yet, just using feed sch d for testing)

Fallback OFF
Set OFF
If FeedD 000 Then ON


Basically, i need a max run time command.

Not quite sure how to program that. I got it in the apex now where it does this. I did it using the defer command.

[mcleodm]

I think i may have figured it out!

This method didnt work before because i wasn't typing the outlet names right.


If Outlet SWFILL-AWC2 = ON Then OFF

I added that command after the if outlet 30G-WC = on then on and each pump turns on and off with each other.

I am such an airhead. Completely forgot how strict the code was.

[jimsflies]

So did I help? lol

[mcleodm]

kind of.

I put in a membership request at that reeftronics site. is it easy to get a membership? It looks pretty neat.

[mcleodm]

Firmware: 4.11L_8B11
Listing generated: 10/12/2011 18:15:09

PROGRAM

SndAlm_I6 [0]
Program Type: Advanced
Display Icon: Sound B
Program:
Set OFF
If Time 13:00 to 13:01 Then ON
If Time 20:00 to 20:01 Then ON

SndWrn_I7 [1]
Program Type: Advanced
Display Icon: Bell
Program:
Set OFF
If Switch2 CLOSED Then ON

EmailAlm_I5 [2]
Program Type: Advanced
Display Icon: Email
Program:
Set OFF
If Temp > 80.5 Then ON
If Temp < 76.5 Then ON
If Switch2 CLOSED Then ON

ATO-AWC1 [3]
Program Type: Advanced
Display Icon: Arrows
Program:
Fallback OFF
Set OFF
If Switch1 CLOSED Then ON
Defer 000:15 Then ON
If Outlet 30G-WC = ON Then OFF
Defer 000:15 Then OFF

SWFILL-AWC2 [4]
Program Type: Advanced
Display Icon: Light A
Program:
Fallback OFF
Set OFF
If Outlet 30G-WC = ON Then ON
Defer 027:05 Then ON
If Outlet WC-OFF = ON Then OFF

SWSEND-AWC3 [5]
Program Type: Advanced
Display Icon: Light A
Program:
Fallback OFF
Set OFF
If Outlet 30G-WC = ON Then ON
Defer 013:35 Then ON
If Outlet SWFILL-AWC2 = ON Then OFF
If Outlet WC-OFF = ON Then OFF

Heater-AWC4 [6]
Program Type: Advanced
Display Icon: Thermometer
Program:
Fallback OFF
Set ON
If Outlet 30G-WC = ON Then OFF

MP40w-DT1 [7]
Program Type: Advanced
Display Icon: Thermometer
Program:
Fallback ON
Set ON

Blank-DT2 [8]
Program Type: Advanced
Display Icon: Thermometer
Program:
Fallback OFF
Set OFF

Actinics-DT3 [9]
Program Type: Advanced
Display Icon: Light A
Program:
Fallback OFF
Set OFF
If Sun 060/180 Then ON

MH-DT4 [10]
Program Type: Advanced
Display Icon: Sun
Program:
Fallback ON
Set OFF
If Sun 120/120 Then ON
If Temp > 82.0 Then OFF
Min Time 030:00 Then OFF

ProteinSkimm [11]
Program Type: Advanced
Display Icon: Light A
Program:
Fallback OFF
Set ON
If Switch2 CLOSED Then OFF
Defer 000:15 Then OFF
If Outlet 30G-WC = ON Then OFF

SWRet-AWC [12]
Program Type: Advanced
Display Icon: Light A
Program:
Fallback OFF
Set OFF
If Outlet 30G-WC = ON Then ON
Defer 000:05 Then ON
If Outlet SWFILL-AWC2 = ON Then OFF
If Outlet SWSEND-AWC3 = ON Then OFF
If Outlet WC-OFF = ON Then OFF

Mag3RET [13]
Program Type: Advanced
Display Icon: Up/Down Arrows
Program:
Fallback ON
Set ON
If Switch2 CLOSED Then OFF
Defer 000:15 Then OFF
If Outlet 30G-WC = ON Then OFF

MainHeater [14]
Program Type: Advanced
Display Icon: Thermometer
Program:
Fallback OFF
Set OFF
If Temp < RT+0.0 Then ON
Defer 000:30 Then ON
If Switch2 CLOSED Then OFF
Defer 000:15 Then OFF

Fluval304 [15]
Program Type: Advanced
Display Icon: Thermometer
Program:
Fallback ON
Set ON
If Switch2 CLOSED Then OFF
Defer 000:15 Then OFF
If Outlet 30G-WC = ON Then OFF

RODISolenoid [16]
Program Type: Advanced
Display Icon: Spiget
Program:
Fallback OFF
Set OFF
If Switch3 CLOSED Then ON
Defer 000:15 Then ON
If Time 00:00 to 01:00 Then OFF
If Time 03:00 to 04:00 Then OFF
If Time 06:00 to 07:00 Then OFF
If Time 09:00 to 10:00 Then OFF
If Time 12:00 to 13:00 Then OFF
If Time 15:00 to 16:00 Then OFF
If Time 18:00 to 19:00 Then OFF
If Time 21:00 to 22:00 Then OFF

FugeLights [17]
Program Type: Advanced
Display Icon: Left/Right Arrows
Program:
Fallback OFF
Set OFF
If Outlet MH-DT4 = OFF Then ON

Mag18RET [18]
Program Type: Advanced
Display Icon: Hourglass
Program:
Fallback ON
Set ON
If Switch2 CLOSED Then OFF
Defer 000:15 Then OFF
If Outlet 30G-WC = ON Then OFF

MP40-DT-L [19]
Program Type: Advanced
Display Icon: Fan
Program:
Fallback Lagoon
Set Lagoon
If Time 09:00 to 10:00 Then Pulse
If Time 10:00 to 12:00 Then ReefCst1
If Time 12:00 to 13:00 Then Pulse
If Time 13:00 to 17:00 Then ReefCst2
If Time 17:00 to 18:00 Then Pulse
If Time 18:00 to 20:00 Then ReefCst1
If Time 20:00 to 23:00 Then Lagoon
If Time 23:00 to 06:00 Then Slow
If Time 06:00 to 09:00 Then Constant
If FeedA 000 Then OFF
If FeedB 000 Then Constant

30G-WC [20]
Program Type: Advanced
Display Icon: Calendar
Program:
Fallback OFF
Set OFF
If FeedD 000 Then ON
If Outlet WC-OFF = ON Then OFF
Defer 000:05 Then OFF

WC-OFF [21]
Program Type: Advanced
Display Icon: Light B
Program:
Fallback OFF
Set OFF
If Outlet 30G-WC = ON Then ON
Defer 056:05 Then ON

Pump1_A3 [22]
Program Type: Pump
Display Icon: Up/Down Arrows
Program:
Fallback ON
OSC 000:00/005:00/005:00 Then ON
If FeedA 000 Then OFF

Pump2_A4 [23]
Program Type: Pump
Display Icon: Up/Down Arrows
Program:
Fallback ON
OSC 005:00/005:00/000:00 Then ON
If FeedA 000 Then OFF


PROFILES

Lagoon [PF1]
Type: Vortech
Vortech Type: Lagoon Random
Maximum Intensity: 60

ReefCst1 [PF2]
Type: Vortech
Vortech Type: Reef Crest
Maximum Intensity: 70

Pulse [PF3]
Type: Vortech
Vortech Type: Pulse
On Time: 2.00
Maximum Intensity: 100

Constant [PF4]
Type: Vortech
Vortech Type: Constant
Maximum Intensity: 65

Slow [PF5]
Type: Vortech
Vortech Type: Constant
Maximum Intensity: 25

ReefCst2 [PF6]
Type: Vortech
Vortech Type: Reef Crest
Maximum Intensity: 100


my current apex config

[jimsflies]

It normally just takes a couple of days to get setup on reeftronics.

[mcleodm]

woohoo. i am on!

check me out
Apex Status (http://www.reeftronics.net/michael-m/apex-status)

[mcleodm]

OK, got my high and low floats installed. Now to brainstorm on how to program all of this. Any ideas?

Switch 1: Return area (ato)
Switch 2: Sump High
Switch 3: RODI Water
Switch 4: Sump Low
Switch 5: SW High
Switch 6: SW Low

I am not quite sure how i would program all of this.

Also, the pump i have going from the sump to the sw drain, any ideas on how to prevent a siphon from happening when i turn that pump on? The trash can is like 1 ft lower then the tank.