Small Powerhead

[dlhirst]

I want to add a small powerhead to my 55g display tank. Mostly, I want it just to create movement along the back/bottom of the tank behind the live rock. It's hard to "vacuum" back there, and probably is a cesspool by now... I don't expect wave action, and I don't want to pay a lot.

Hopefully too, it is something I can buy locally? I know you can't answer that last part, but I just mean "standard brand" stuff. Koralia Nano? Tunze NanoStream? Better choices?

[dlhirst]

Bump for a second shot at a good answer...

[jimsflies]

I think either a koralia, hydor or nano stream would work fine.

[MizTanks]

Sweetest mini pump out there!! Aquarium Water Circulation and Powerheads: Hydor Pico Evolution Mini Pump (http://www.drsfostersmith.com/product/prod_display.cfm?c=3578%204587%2021414&pcatid=21414)

[AZDesertRat]

I would say your best value would be an Evolutions 750 for that size tank. I have two Evcolutions Nano 425's in a 16G nano and they are pretty lame even in a tank that small.

Big Al's Online had all their Evolutions for half price recently, I bought two 1100's for $32 apiece but not sure if the yare still on sale or not. Worth checking out though for that price savings as they were over $70 ea. locally.

[binford4000]

I personally prefer the tunze power heads over the korila line. They take a lot less room and create good flow. The 6025 does a nice job and is priced well. Most LFS will match online prices or will come close . The nice thing about a LFS is they back what they sell and won't just give you the manufactures phone number. Here's a link.

Tunze Turbelle Nano Stream 6025 High Flow Water Pump - AquaCave.com (http://www.aquacave.com/Tunze-Turbelle-Nano-Stream-6025-High-Flow-Water-Pump-P1368C779.aspx)

http://www.aquacave.com/Submersible-Water-Pumps-Powerheads-C1024.aspx

[jstan]

All I can say is I've replaced 3 koralia's in a two year period.

[AZDesertRat]

Hydor Koralia Evolutions have a two year guarantee and their customer service is excellent. I have never heard of anyone being asked to show proof of ownership. For the price and the guarantee you can't beat them.

Tunze Nanostreams are a great product but a lot more expensive, now you are getting in the MP-10 territory.

[binford4000]

Hydor Koralia Evolutions have a two year guarantee and their customer service is excellent. I have never heard of anyone being asked to show proof of ownership. For the price and the guarantee you can't beat them.

Tunze Nanostreams are a great product but a lot more expensive, now you are getting in the MP-10 territory.

At a LFS I agree an online vender will simply tell you to call them. The 6025 is only 65 bucks roughly!, MP10 is close to 300. But they are well worth the money!

[dlhirst]

Great stuff, folks. I knew I could get a spirited debate on this one. So, one thing I had not considered was the fact that I need this to push water most of 36" across the back of the tank. Equals more power than I first thought.

Can anyone tell me how much temp rise I might see from these? I seem to struggle with heat already as I have a closed top tank...

And yes, as much as is humanly possible, I try to buy locally. Even when the price isn't matched...

[binford4000]

You shouldn't see much change in temp from either of the debated brands. The evo's work we'll but do have starting issues. Some times the motor reverse's and also they take up allot of space. The 6025 will travel 36 also. Either one will do what ya want tho it's really upto your taste in your tanks presentation. I have a mp10 es w laying around if you want to try a vortech. I can lend it to you. Just be warned ,once you use one you'll want one ! Lol

[jimsflies]

Have you considered two pumps? One on either side. The type of pumps we are discussing aren't really great for providing a high velocity sediment moving type flow. The stream type pumps are good for providing high volume low velocity/pressure type flow. They are great pumps for moving a lot of water, but lack the flow intensity relative to other styles of pumps. Of course with that said, you could get a larger modeled of the above discussed pumps and probably achieve what you want. Its a matter of balancing size/function.

You may be better off with a maxijet 1200 (or similar).

[dputt88]

i know im a little late for this one but i would sugget a koralia nano 425. i have the 240 in my 30 gal cube along with 2 oversized HOB filters. this should be an affordable way to stir things up back there.

[Rabidgoose]

I will suggest 1 or 2 Tunze 6025 hidden behind your rockwork. Price in these discussions is relative but the Tunze is readily available, moves a fair amount of water and is basically bulletproof. I can't speak to there warranty as I've never needed it. :)

chuck

[slapshot]

Tunze is awesome, but to pay nearly double the price for a powerhead that is going to be from the sounds of it tucked behind the rockwork anyways does a slightly bigger sized koralia make much difference? Also the possible start and reverse issues only come into play when you have them on a timer or turn them on and off frequently.... most can be solved FME with a dab of glue on the rubber bump stop as well ;) I have been using my 3 1400's for over 2 years now, and a 750 for about a year, all but the 750 have been on a timer the entire time as well. Only time I have had issues were when the rubber stop on the front cover came out and jammed the propeller, glued them all in place and haven't had a problem since.

As far as heat, I ran my 180 at 75.5 degrees w/o issue w/o a chiller for 2 years, hottest it ever got to was 77.1 and that was on a day that was over 80 and we didn't run the a/c.

For the purpose of the pump I would go with a koralia 550-750 atleast and put the extra 20-30 towards something cooler ;) lol

This is a case of you get what you pay for though. I would submit the Tunze out performs the cheaper ones by pushing the water farther.

[slapshot]

Yeah my tunze 6060 (1600gph) will kill my evolution 1400's for distance.... but the compared initial cost it kills it as well... and for a 55g do you really need to be able to push the water 6' instead of 3-4'? lol

True enough, but my koralias 6 won't push past 2 feet.

[binford4000]

Well we should get the truth of which will work best soon. I lent him a korila,a tunze and a vortech mp10 so let the results speak for themselves! :oldman:

Man I need to clean out that fish room,too much stuff laying around. Lol

[Rabidgoose]

The thread has been edited so please direct your comments/posts to the OP

thanks......chuck

[dlhirst]

Yes, thanks for your generosity, Chuck.

I started, of course, with the MP10. I know this thing will do a world of different things, but I have it set to constant velocity - about 80% right now. I want to compare it only against the abilities of the other two. One quick result was that my protein skimmer finally seems to be functioning well. I guess a lot of crap had been settling out, but now is finding the overflow AND the protein skimmer!

Trying to come up with an objective method of judging the results...

[dputt88]

Well we should get the truth of which will work best soon. I lent him a korila,a tunze and a vortech mp10 so let the results speak for themselves! :oldman:

Man I need to clean out that fish room,too much stuff laying around. Lol

way to go binford, i love hearing about this kind of generosity within our community.

[binford4000]

Yes, thanks for your generosity, Chuck.

I started, of course, with the MP10. I know this thing will do a world of different things, but I have it set to constant velocity - about 80% right now. I want to compare it only against the abilities of the other two. One quick result was that my protein skimmer finally seems to be functioning well. I guess a lot of crap had been settling out, but now is finding the overflow AND the protein skimmer!

Trying to come up with an objective method of judging the results...

Oh man this test has been ruined ! LOL now all you have left is disappointment ! Lmao yeah vortech's really move the junk off the floor. Keep the results comeing !

[dlhirst]

Chuck, my goal is to be objective here. That is why I am only using the continuous flow mode. When I am convinced that all of the gunk is blown off the sand bed back there, I am going to switch to another PH. Based on what folks have said, I will try the Tunze next. At this point, my subjective results will include performance of the protein skimmer and the color of the (almost clean again) sand bed. I have about a cup or two of unused aragonite, so I know what color it was to start...
What I don't yet have is a good OBJECTIVE test - something with hard numbers. I probably should have tested NO3 before and immediately after starting the pump. To see if it was in my tank, but possibly having settled out? The red algae has to be eating something. And my tests (and those of several LFS) always came up with 0% N and 0% NO3.
Any suggestions on an objective test?

[binford4000]

I was only jockeing with ya. It depends on the test kits that you are using. API kits and strips usually read off compared to the higher end kits like the lamode kits and salifert I would suggest using one test kit and only use that brand to compile the info. Personal I think the best method of checking the distance and strength of the Power heads would be to place some kind of mesh on the opposite end and see which one gathers the most material in a set amount of time. Food for thought is all. Looking forward to your results. :oldman:

[slapshot]

Just attach a streamer on a piece of rock and set it at the end of your rock work opposite the pump and see which one moves it the best.

[dlhirst]

Great ideas, guys. Too late for that "don't disturb the sand bed" thing. That MP10 pretty much scoured the sand back to white. Now I just need a day to try them all.

[binford4000]

Any updates on your progress ?

[dlhirst]

So, after extensive playing around with these PHs, including moving them around to different spots in the tank, I really don't have a great "answer" for anyone. :(
All three PHs moved more than enough water in my 56 gal DT. It's only about 38" across, so it was not hard for these three pumps to bounce water off the far wall and beyond. In fact, all three probably pushed a little too much water IMO. I used a product called the MiniPhaser that stained glass artists use to dial down their soldering irons on the Tunze and Hydnor pumps. It worked well at backing them off a bit. The VorTech came with its own controller to do that - and more. I never played with the "more" for two reasons - 1. It wasn't part of this little experiment. 2. If I did, I would probably have liked it even more!
I don't really know the GPH of these three pumps, but I do believe the VorTech at full bore pushed a lot more water. Sand bed flew like crazy, and if it was pointing at our clam, Stafford, well, he was not pleased. But, even wide open, none of these pumps seemed to be so strong as to annoy the fish. I generally tested the VT at about 70%, and the other two at something more - 85-90%?.
The biggest disappointment in this test was that NONE of the pumps did what I was aiming for, and that was to make my cyanobacteria go away. It didn't. For a while, I thought it had, but what I realized was the pumps just blew it to a new spot in the tank. On a happy note, the protein skimmer works much better with the increased flow. So, the water never looked clearer!
The VT was of course, bullet proof. Great flow, quietest of the three, all the special control features, and a VERY small in tank profile. The only draw back was the OUTside of the tank had the ugly motor part. It was of great interest to my 4 yr old. And, if you move it just a fraction, the inside impeller no longer functions. So, wet hands...
The Tunze was annoying when it would turn on. All that clicking noise! It did quiet down, but dang first use I thought I had broken it already. (And remember, it was only a loaner!) Once it quieted down, I thought it was probably the mid-noise pump. I liked the directionality feature on this pump the best. Especially with the motor/cord IN the tank, I really needed to stick it in a corner. I saw online that they even make a rock to hide it. Cool idea.
The Hydnor pump worked fine. It had the largest in tank profile, which made it difficult for me to place it (with existing rockwork) in the tank. But, if it was there from the start, it would be OK. It seemed to be the noisiest, but still quieter than I thought any of them would be. Like the Tunze, it had the motor/cord inside the tank. So, effort at hiding that stuff is required.
So, what can I say? They all moved water. They all improved my water from protein skimmer removal. But, apparently, flow was not the answer to my cyano issue. Damn! Back to the drawing board...

[binford4000]

Great review tho ! Sorry to read your back to square one.

[dlhirst]

Attached is a photo that I took showing the in-tank profile of each of these pumps. Ranging from 1.5" up to 6". This is not an insignificant consideration, especially with a smaller tank like mine.

Also, when setting the magnets on these to the foamcore, I noticed the Hydnor pump's magnets did not hold as securely as the other two. That was not noticed when I used them on the tank, so I don't know if it is a foamcore thing... but, my guess is, that magnet is probably less "attractive" on larger tanks (with thicker glass walls).

And, THANKS AGAIN, Binford, for the opportunity to try all of this. Your PHs are heading back today.

[dlhirst]

Good eye, Chris! You are correct, the original thought was to clean up the "back alley". All pumps did that very well. But, when showing the tank to a guy a few weeks back, he mentioned that I should also see the cyano disappear if I improved the water flow. So, I kinda tagged that along on my "wish list". Sorry to confuse.

I occasionally dose vodka. Usually Sunday mornings, with Vivio's bloody mary mix... But, I don't share that with the fish.

I do have a bag of carbon and a bag of GFO in the sump at all times. But, I will say I am not real quick to replace them. Maybe every other month? Each "bag" which is really a nylon knee length hose will hold about 1.5 cups of either. When I am back there, and feeling lazy, I just kinda give them a few squishes, to move the granules around - hoping it exposes new nooks and crannies. But, for a real complete change - How often should I be doing that?

[binford4000]

Got the package today Don. Nice packing job. Tx and nice meeting ya !

[pjr]

Great write up!

I also found the external motors of the Vortechs problematic. Bumped them too often, and also found it unsightly. Maybe if my tank was built into the wall it would not have that annoyance, but....

I had a 6025 laying around (just sold it a few days ago) and found it very quiet. I wonder if the one you tested had an issue.

I've used a Koralia nano in the past (ideal for a nano but not much more) and there's a K1 in pjr-ette's breeder 50; does a very nice job in that application, pretty quiet too.

Wednesday I purchased a 6045 to augment the flow on the 130g tank. It's the same size as a 6025 but I believe more than twice the flow! For $90 it's one of the best deals around; nice quality, solid warrant, very flexible design, small size makes it easy to hide, and a great clamp system that allows you to direct flow at problem areas (i.e., detritus and cyano). In comparison to a MP10, it's a lot of flow an a much lower cost (but no controllability like the Vortechs).

Maybe more flow in the overall tank will eliminate the cyano issue.... there's one thing for sure: cyano HATES flow. That's pretty well documented!

[dlhirst]

pjr - I should have been more clear - NONE of the pumps were noisy. ALL were quieter than I had expected. I am just saying that relative to the others, it was noisiest... And, yeah, I am probably gonna have to do something for more flow. Soon.