Who to trust?

[ReeferRob]

Im at a total loss for words to be honest. I don't know where to turn or which company to trust.

My API test kits no matter what the issue is ALWAYS read perfectly?
ELOS seems to be a well respected company, but in my experience are the least consistent?
Salifert another supposedly well respected company, not sure if they are accurate or test high?

ELOS for example, in the past 10 months I have purchase 3 of their Calcium test kits. Each one has arrived with different size test vials and caps, which are not cross compatible. Each test kit has arrived with different volumes of testing reagents. My first package I ran out of one of the reagents after only 15 test that were said to make 50 tests. Contacted ELOS and via email was told that more was in the mail to my house, which never arrived? Second test kit as well as the third all ran short. In every case, all three test had completly different amounts of basically everything.
If they can't consistantly fill their bottles with the appropriate amount of testing solution, how am I to trust the results?

Salifert test I suppose are the ones that really began to make me nervous. I never really relied on the API's, but when the ELOS alk and calc test were very close to the API I tend to believe them to be accurate. However last week I ordered a salifert Nitrate and Calcium test.
According to Nitrates, I am at roughly 30ppm of trates:blackeye: and if I compare my ELOS calcium results of 440 to the Saliferts of 560 is were I grow even more leery??

Who do you trust?
How do you care, clean and store your testing vials and testing equipment?
How often should one calibrate electronic or mechanical testing or monitoring systems? (RKL pH, salinity, Hanna pH etc.)
What methods, techniques, and calibration equipment do you recommend?

[ardo_ski]

I've been very happy with the kits from Lamotte. They are good quality and sell refill kits. Currently using the Ca, Alk, and Nitrate. The Phosphate Kit I use is High Sensitivity Phosphate Test Kit. When I'm done I rinse and wipe down eveything in RO water. Than rinse again and let air dry.

[jolson10450]

like they always say.

a man with one test kit knows what his parameter are, a man with two test kits is never sure!

i use all salifert test for everything and i do not go by what other test kits say for this reason.

[stunreefer]

I use LaMotte for Alk/Ca.

API for NO3 (assuming it's remotely close I'm fine).

I used to use ELOS for MAG, but they changed the package, and as you mentioned seem to make changes more often than not - change is not always good ;) I have an ELOS NO3 kits as well that I think I used once.

I used to swear by Salifert, but went through their bad test phase when I was an Acro head - lost a fair share of them chasing numbers. Will never use them again, although I know more than a few people who use them and swear by them.

I'll be using all Hanna digitals once they come out, can't wait, and neither can the lazy reefer in me ;)

Any probes should be calibrated at least bi-weekly. I calibrate refractometer before every use, but I prefer my floating hydormeter (high grade) to refractometers. Regarding cleaning, dump, rinse in tap several times, then rinse in RO/DI and let dry. Rinse in RO/DI before use next time and swish tank water in vial prior to running test. Make sure to never put the vials in your system to fill with water, use a pipette.

[Manoj's Reef]

Rob,

to be honest , its hard to say.

Let me give you the current nightmare that I am facing:

1. I used to use salifert for about 2 yrs, then recently I moved to elos because BRS shipped me elos instead of salifert. But since I knew they were decent I used them.

2. Initially when I compared elos and salifert, I found my elos to read low on alk and about the same for calcium

3. Since I heard/read elos was better so I used elos as the test kit to move forward with and I started to increase my alk.

4. Now my SPS tips are burning and I knew it was high alk. Currently I am in the process of loosing about half of my SPS ( About 1 yr of growth out of the window)

5. So now I moved back to salifert. I have not dosed the alk solution for the last 4 days and my alk is still high, by the rate at which its dropping I will restart dosing Tuesday night.

So moral of the story in my opinon is, if you have a test kit that works for you and your corals are doing fine stick with it. I know once in a while you will have bad batches and you will have to watch out for that.

Had to let it out lol :smash:I hope it helps

[MizTanks]

I've used nothing but API for the last 10yrs-first for FW and now for SW-never an issue. I haven't tried anything else. I use a refractormeter and calibrate it with RO every 4-6 months.

[ReeferRob]

like they always say.

a man with one test kit knows what his parameter are, a man with two test kits is never sure!

i use all salifert test for everything and i do not go by what other test kits say for this reason.

Great point.


I use LaMotte for Alk/Ca.

API for NO3 (assuming it's remotely close I'm fine).


Based on my findings, relying on API can be quite dangerous. API was telling me I was in the money, then I cross referenced it to the Salifert and I was at almost 50ppm before a past due water change.



I'll be using all Hanna digitals once they come out, can't wait, and neither can the lazy reefer in me ;)

Any probes should be calibrated at least bi-weekly. I calibrate refractometer before every use, but I prefer my floating hydormeter (high grade) to refractometers. Regarding cleaning, dump, rinse in tap several times, then rinse in RO/DI and let dry. Rinse in RO/DI before use next time and swish tank water in vial prior to running test. Make sure to never put the vials in your system to fill with water, use a pipette.

I am anxiously awaiting the Hanna digi's as well. I don't consider myself a lazy reefer, but when I comes to testing......there are many other things I would rather do! Plus there seems to be way too much inconsistency with in the test kits, as well as human error.

Im glad you made it a point to mention that a reefer should never dip the test vial into the reef water directly. A newbie may not know the importance of this. I always fill a small plastic dixie cup with reef water and then use a syringe to fill the test vials.

I also use an old babys bottle drying rack to hold and dry all my test vials up side down and caps to dry out after a thorough rising in tap, and then a quick roll in some RO.


Rob,

to be honest , its hard to say.

So moral of the story in my opinon is, if you have a test kit that works for you and your corals are doing fine stick with it. I know once in a while you will have bad batches and you will have to watch out for that.

Had to let it out lol :smash:I hope it helps

Again a great point. Like Mucho always says "Listen to your reef, it will give you the answers" Through close observation with one's eyes and one test kit brand is the way to go for me.

[henry hill]

Ah test kits?

[rmalone]

Currently I am using Salifert for nitrate, cal, alk, and mag. I don't test for anything else. My experience with api is that the cal seems to jive with salifert, nitrate has given me some false negatives (it could be me I suppose), one test would show 0 nitrates and the next test from the same sample might show 20ppm nitrates. When I used api I would always test twice.

My next kits will be Lamotte for cal and alk. I will probably stick with Salifert for nitrate and mag.

I set up a nitrate test with Ocean, Tetra, Salifert and API. The discrepency in readings was scary to say the least. I have never seen the Ocean nitrate test show ANY nitrates despite readings by every other kit.

[streetrodder007]

I have used API for the last couple years. But I have always wondered- 99% of all my tests show I have near perfect tank water. Are the tests bad and always error towards a good reading? Or am I that good at keeping perfect water? I think not.
The only tests I have noticed that do fluctuate a lot are Calcium.

[reefpoor]

Can you guys elaborate on why you would not dip vials into tank water to rinse, before running test

[BeakerBob]

Let's start from the beginning:

Are all test kits the same? NO. The quality control on test kits vary by manufacturer. Lamott & Hach test kits are most reliable. All saltwater test kits are semi-quantitative.....WHY?...they lack the quality control needed to ensure accuracy & precision. If you want to make sure your test kits are accurate, precise and reproducible, then you MUST run a positive and negative control. The positive MUST be of a certain value of which you compare the tank water test result with.

Which test kits are the most reliable? In my experience, Hach and Lamotte are the most reliable and consistent. The reason for this is because they are sold primarily for testing drinking and waste water samples, not aquarium tank water.

How often do you need to check the calibration of the test kits and probes? I would check as often as I felt that they are stable. pH probes tend to drift, so they need to be checked at least once a week even if they are properly stored. Refractometers are a little more stable, but the calibration fluid is cheap, so why not check each time? Nitrate/Nitrite kits should be checked at the 1st time to make sure it is accurate and precise, and at least monthly if the reagents are opened. The new Hanna Phosphate meter checks itself by blanking with neat tank water 1st, then with the reagents.

[BeakerBob]

Can you guys elaborate on why you would not dip vials into tank water to rinse, before running test

You do not want to take the chance of contaminating your tank water with chemical reagents. You should take an aliquot of the tank water out of the tank and put it into a separate container. Use this sample to test your tank parameters. Do NOT put any left over sample water back into your tank.

This is basic chemistry testing laboratory procedures. It prevents contaminating the main source (tank) in the event you forget what you are doing or make a mistake.

[ReeferRob]

BEAKERBOB- What would you suggest as the most reliable calibration solutions for refractometers and say Digital Aquatics pH and salinity probes? I have some DIYREEF.COM refractor solution, but unsure of quality and shelf life?

[reefpoor]

I have always rinsed vials after testing in RO water, again in RO water before using the next time. Then I would dip/rinse in tank water and run test. I have no idea where I got that from, but we won't be doing that any more.:smash::smash::smash::smash:


You do not want to take the chance of contaminating your tank water with chemical reagents. You should take an aliquot of the tank water out of the tank and put it into a separate container. Use this sample to test your tank parameters. Do NOT put any left over sample water back into your tank.

This is basic chemistry testing laboratory procedures. It prevents contaminating the main source (tank) in the event you forget what you are doing or make a mistake.

[schminksbro]

I trust Lamotte alk kits but I don't test for anything else. I just look at my tank.

[Bluering]

API ..... Tested against salifert and lamotte, came up with similar results to close to pay that higher dollar amount.

[jimsflies]

Bob is there a source that a reefer could get check samples (known concentrations) to run their own verification on test kits? I'm sure there could be variability by batch or lot for a given manufacturer. Would it be worth it for the reefer who is concerned about achieving the best results possible to run an occasional check sample...or at least do one each time they open a new pack of reagents?

[stunreefer]

Based on my findings, relying on API can be quite dangerous. API was telling me I was in the money, then I cross referenced it to the Salifert and I was at almost 50ppm before a past due water change.
Yeah, A.P.I. is quick and easy, but past that they're definitely the lower end of the totem pole ;) IIRC, I've only tested NO3 once since November (when the AGE went back up) so I'm not too worried about it. Corals and fish are very happy :) I would be skeptical of your 50 ppm reading from Salifert though - many corals would not be too happy with that level, although I did see you mention some favia issues as of late. I would also expect your Acros to be pretty ticked off at 50 ppm.

I use a refractormeter and calibrate it with RO every 4-6 months.
You should consider recalibrating your refractometer more frequently, and definitely use Calibration Solution, not RO water. RO water calibrate to the low end of the scale, and we want mid range (depending on your scale).

[ReeferRob]

I would be skeptical of your 50 ppm reading from Salifert though - many corals would not be too happy with that level, although I did see you mention some favia issues as of late. I would also expect your Acros to be pretty ticked off at 50 ppm.


See that's the thing, everything in the DT is just fine. Everything is happy, well except me.......
The favia issue is going on in the "grow out." Different tank.

[jay13]

API ..... Tested against salifert and lamotte, came up with similar results to close to pay that higher dollar amount.

i believe what he is saying is the quality controls from these higher dollar test kits are more reliable. the problem seems to be variance between one test kit and another from these same companies. lamotte has always been the gold standard ever since i started back in the early 90's. i don't test much, more look at the animals and then test if i think it is needed. as someone said at the start of the thread you can really do damage chasing numbers. a one time comparison of test kits is not a definite that the cheaper one is as sensitive,precise or dependable as say lamotte. meaning it was all good this time but three kits down the road and it might be way off.