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Negative Intense Lighting Effects on Ps -n- Zs


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  1. #1
    Wy Renegade - Reefkeeper CR Member
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    Default Negative Intense Lighting Effects on Ps -n- Zs

    Been thinking about this one for awhile, and have some thoughts and questions, so I thought after reading Mooch's latest thread that it might be time to throw this out there as well.

    I think that we can all agree that all Ps -n- Zs don't do equally well under equal amounts of light. Some do better under brighter lighting, others do better under dim lighting.

    I think that we can also agree that many can be acclimated to different levels of lighting, if its done correctly and slowly over time. What "correctly and slowly" means in some cases is going to depend on the specific coral we are talking about.

    I think that we can also agree that some polyps will change their appearance based on the intensity of the lighting they receive. For the sake of discussion, we are going to ignore the effects of different lighting spectrums (although I realize it still plays into the discussion in some degree).

    I think that we can also agree that exposing polyps to too intense of a light too quickly can also cause negative effects, such as bleaching.

    So, my questions are;

    Besides the obvious bleaching of a coral, what are some of the signs that indicate that a polyp is receiving too much light?

    and

    What is the overall time frame during which this can and does occur? Minutes, hours, days, weeks, or even months?
    I collect PEs, and I'm always looking to trade for ones I don't have yet.

  2. #2
    cg5071 - Reefkeeper CR Member
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    I have noticed a couple different frags of zoas that get a real concentrated amount of color. Almost fake/plastic looking since the colors got so bold. I have both multiple frags of a couple that look totaly different from each other and also I have seen it happen to another overtime. As in a couple of months. I do not know if this harms them in any way. The 2 notable ones are GreenBay packers and the flaming rainbows/mandarins. I think I have a pic of one to add but if not I will take them over the weekend and show the difference. Here are the GBP. The brighter ones have not reversed to normal either, they have been side by side for many months now.

    Name:  DSCF3641.jpg
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  3. #3
    Kev Apsley - Reefkeeper CR Member
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    my space monster have lost the black speckling so I am wondering if it's from too much light

  4. #4
    Wy Renegade - Reefkeeper CR Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by cg5071 View Post
    I have noticed a couple different frags of zoas that get a real concentrated amount of color. Almost fake/plastic looking since the colors got so bold. I have both multiple frags of a couple that look totaly different from each other and also I have seen it happen to another overtime. As in a couple of months. I do not know if this harms them in any way. The 2 notable ones are GreenBay packers and the flaming rainbows/mandarins. I think I have a pic of one to add but if not I will take them over the weekend and show the difference. Here are the GBP. The brighter ones have not reversed to normal either, they have been side by side for many months now.

    Name:  DSCF3641.jpg
Views: 221
Size:  95.1 KB


    Thanks Chris, definitely adds support to the idea that light affects colors in zoas. If you get a chance, post up that other pictures.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kev Apsley View Post
    my space monster have lost the black speckling so I am wondering if it's from too much light
    Kev, mine have done the same, I'm actually wondering if its from too little light. Several I know keep them high under pretty intense lighting.
    I collect PEs, and I'm always looking to trade for ones I don't have yet.

  5. #5
    Sir Patrick - Reefkeeper A2 Club Coordinator
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    I normally see a polyp close up, and not open, when given too much light to fast or not acclimated properly to intense light.

    Usually, if I see them added new, into a tank, they will open the first day or 2, but then close up, and will not open till they either acclimate or start to melt. This normally happens when the light intensity is just too much to bare, IME.

    I mostly see polyps bleach when given more light than they can tollerate, for long periods of time, but not enough light to shock them into closing. Depending on the polyp and the light intensity, I have seen this happen at a slow rate, over the course of a few weeks, to very fast- like 5 days or so.

    Another indicator I have seen, that is a flag that the coral is receiving too much light, or as much light as it might want to tolerate, is speckling. A polyp that is not normally speckled, that develops them with more light may be getting close to handling as much light as it is going to be able- before bleaching or closing up. Not saying it will bleach/close, but the lighting is starting to push its limits. I have seen lots of cool morphs this way, Particularly in the PE's.

  6. #6
    MizTanks - Reefkeeper
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    I personally would love to see those who are *successfully* keeping any zoas under 10k cf. I for one have not been able to.
    Sir has been following along with me on this issue I've had for some time. My tank is mature and stable. Therefor I must assume it has something if not everything to do with poor lighting conditions.
    They've most likely come from a stronger light source-not to many peps growing zoas under cf for selling.
    Just my observation of my tank.

    Radio Active Dragon Eyes=8g tank-18w 10k-18w 420/430nm on sand bed
    639cfcc8 7634 d7b7 - Negative Intense Lighting Effects on Ps -n- Zs

    However they no longer look like this. I raised them higher, they began to fade. Brought them back down for several weeks, still faded. Now they're back up and I hope they'll adjust
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  7. #7
    cg5071 - Reefkeeper CR Member
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    Miz tanks, my first tank/zoas were under 10k and the same actintic as yours. They did ok but deffinately better under t5's. They were also on a shelf near the top though, about 9" down.

    I will get the other pic later. It is almost the exact same as above, one really concentrated color and the other "normal"


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  8. #8
    Wy Renegade - Reefkeeper CR Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by MizTanks View Post
    I personally would love to see those who are *successfully* keeping any zoas under 10k cf. However they no longer look like this. I raised them higher, they began to fade. Brought them back down for several weeks, still faded. Now they're back up and I hope they'll adjust
    Jamie I assume that when you say cf (compact flourescents) you are referring to PCs (Power compact flourescents), not the 10K daylight cf bulbs you can pick up at say home depot?

    Zoas can be kept under power compacts, I've done so in the past, although I am not currently. Here's a picture of my tank back in 2004. The zoas are hard to see, but are spread across the entire upper part of the tank (look like little dots);

    img056 - Negative Intense Lighting Effects on Ps -n- Zs
    sorry for the quality of the picture, but its the best I have from back then.

    In this one (same tank) you can see some brown button polps that were able to thrive a little further down in the tank
    img058 - Negative Intense Lighting Effects on Ps -n- Zs

    In my experience with PCs and zoas, for the most part zoas need to be kept high under in order to thrive. Lower will maintain them, but not usually allow them to thrive. From what you've said and what I've seen in your thread, it sounds like you may have rushed the light acclimation process a bit. You used the screen process did you? A week for each layer? I've seen RDE kept under extremely bright lights, so with proper acclimation, PC shouldn't be too much for them. I'd give them a bit more time to recover, and then move them up slowly (an 1" or 2" at a time with 3 to 5 days in each new location).
    I collect PEs, and I'm always looking to trade for ones I don't have yet.

  9. #9
    MizTanks - Reefkeeper
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    Thanks Wy! No I didn't use the screen method not really sure what that entails. Yes I was referring to PC's. I was hoping that it was light related. If it's something else I sure can't find it
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  10. #10
    Wy Renegade - Reefkeeper CR Member
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    Thank you Chris, this is the direction I was hoping we would go with this thread.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sir Patrick View Post
    I normally see a polyp close up, and not open, when given too much light too fast or not acclimated properly to intense light.

    Usually, if I see them added new, into a tank, they will open the first day or 2, but then close up, and will not open till they either acclimate or start to melt. This normally happens when the light intensity is just too much to bare, IME. .
    Excellent observation Chris! to this I would add that the actually period of melting can take some time, but the closing of the polyp often occur relatively quickly. This is not something that should happen to an established colony unless you have recently changed your bulbs or lighting methods. Any body have any experience with the time frame for closing being longer than a couple of days? Seems that some of the growout frags either had fragging issues, lighting issues or something of that nature. I had several that opened up for a couple weeks, and seemed to be doing well (although no new growth), then they just closed up and started melting away.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sir Patrick View Post
    I mostly see polyps bleach when given more light than they can tollerate, for long periods of time, but not enough light to shock them into closing. Depending on the polyp and the light intensity, I have seen this happen at a slow rate, over the course of a few weeks, to very fast- like 5 days or so.
    Another excellent observation. So would we say that some light fading of the coral or brightness of the oral disc may be a somewhat earlier indicator of this same issue or in your observation do they go straight from bright to bleached (think you kind of indicated this in the last sentence, but wanted to get clarification).


    Quote Originally Posted by Sir Patrick View Post
    Another indicator I have seen, that is a flag that the coral is receiving too much light, or as much light as it might want to tolerate, is speckling. A polyp that is not normally speckled, that develops them with more light may be getting close to handling as much light as it is going to be able- before bleaching or closing up. Not saying it will bleach/close, but the lighting is starting to push its limits. I have seen lots of cool morphs this way, Particularly in the PE's.
    So if a polyp was speckling, exposing it to increased light intensity with say a bulb change, might push that polyp over the edge and cause either the bleaching or melting that was mentioned earlier?
    I collect PEs, and I'm always looking to trade for ones I don't have yet.

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