I have 90 gallon tank 48x18x24 (LxWxH) that was in storage for ~17 years, and is currently being used as a baffle-less sump/fuge. I'm in the planning stages to upgrade my 50 to this tank and I like the look of rimless tanks. Most info. I've read says that rim removal is only safe with small tanks (10 gallon or less) and I am normally against removal of tank trim. However, I believe this situation/tank may be different. Here's why...
The glass thickness (3/8") is the same that Great Lakes Aquariums uses for its rimless tanks of the same dimensions.
It has a manufacturer installed 2" wide 3/8" thick glass center brace (see photos)
The plastic trim is relatively flimsy compared to a 75 gallons I have
So, my questions are...
Should I remove the top trim from my tank to make it rimless?*
Would it be necessary to install glass around the perimeter of the tank (eurobrace-style) if I remove the trim?
If I decide to remove the trim would it be worth it to fill the tank with FW for a few months as a test?
*I understand the risk of removing the top trim and won't blame anyone who says "yes" if down the line there is a catestrophic consequences.
I would normaly say bracing can only be taken off on smaller tanks, but....
I see the extra thick glass and the glass bracing. I am no expert, but I dont even see a need to euro brace on this one. Alot of the older tanks, especialy the ones with the glass center brace are built with the plastic trim being only cosmetic, from what I remember growing up.
I recall reading that the edges of trimmed tanks are often unfinished (not polished.) I'd be concerned with cuts from sharp edges.
That said, I don't think I'd do it. 17 years in storage is a long time. I'd be concerned about the silicone degrading and any problems being exasperated by the removal of the trim. IMO, 90 gallons is too much water to take any uncalculated risk with.
But that's just my uneducated opinion - I'm a chicken when it comes to the possibility of saltwater on the floor (and everywhere thereunder.)
The glass under that trim is most likely not only sharp, but may not line up in the corners. I took apart a tank from a "local", and the glass was off by nearly a HALF INCH in one corner. (The space was filled with silicone. )
As for the euro brace idea, I like that over going straight rimless with a 3/8" tank. A 1/2" I would be all for going rimless on.
That said, I don't think I'd do it. 17 years in storage is a long time. I'd be concerned about the silicone degrading and any problems being exasperated by the removal of the trim. IMO, 90 gallons is too much water to take any uncalculated risk with.
+1
If I were to do it with this tank I would be sure the glass is polished (or get some of the items to do it myself) and then I would cut the entire tank apart and re-glue it together with some RTV103 or RTV108 depending if you want black or clear silicone seams.
Thanks for all of the replies. You guys are pretty much echoing all of my concerns while also giving me some additional things to think about.
Originally Posted by Sir Patrick
I would normaly say bracing can only be taken off on smaller tanks, but....
I see the extra thick glass and the glass bracing. I am no expert, but I dont even see a need to euro brace on this one. Alot of the older tanks, especialy the ones with the glass center brace are built with the plastic trim being only cosmetic, from what I remember growing up.
I could be wrong, but....
^ this sums up my thoughts pretty well.
Originally Posted by CalmSeasQuest
I recall reading that the edges of trimmed tanks are often unfinished (not polished.) I'd be concerned with cuts from sharp edges.
That said, I don't think I'd do it. 17 years in storage is a long time. I'd be concerned about the silicone degrading and any problems being exasperated by the removal of the trim. IMO, 90 gallons is too much water to take any uncalculated risk with.
But that's just my uneducated opinion - I'm a chicken when it comes to the possibility of saltwater on the floor (and everywhere thereunder.)
Good points. I had planned on finishing the edges.
IME silicone does not degrade. My current tank has been up for 11 years and my dad has a FW thank that has been set up for more than 30 years. From my searches on other forums the general consensus is that UV can degrade silicone but little else. This tank has been stored in a cool dark basement for the duration.
I too am nervous about this. Thus the thread. If I decide to go for it I'll likely do a several month leak test with FW.
Originally Posted by Poseidon
The glass under that trim is most likely not only sharp, but may not line up in the corners. I took apart a tank from a "local", and the glass was off by nearly a HALF INCH in one corner. (The space was filled with silicone. )
As for the euro brace idea, I like that over going straight rimless with a 3/8" tank. A 1/2" I would be all for going rimless on.
I think the glass under the trim is pretty good. The trim is quite flimsy and I can pull the inside edge out and get my finger pretty close to the top. Can't be 100% certain but it seem good.
I agree Euro brace seems wise.
Originally Posted by XSiVE
+1
If I were to do it with this tank I would be sure the glass is polished (or get some of the items to do it myself) and then I would cut the entire tank apart and re-glue it together with some RTV103 or RTV108 depending if you want black or clear silicone seams.
Personally I'm more confident in a 17+ year old silicone done by a professional than anything I could do... mostly because I hear RTV can be tricky to get right.
One of the main reasons I'm even considering this is that the trim on this tank is so wimpy and there is glass center brace already in place. I'll get a few trim measurements on it as well as my other tanks for comparison and will post them later on.
Thanks for all of the input and please keep them coming.
keep the glass brace and remove the trim. finish the edges then fill it all the way to the very top. double check it for how square it is. you can do this by either using a level or a piece of string. take the string and put it at the very outer tip of one side and the very outer tip at the other size and let the line sit on top of the tank glass and see if there are any visible arches/bows in the glass. the string will help you picture a straight line compared to one with a load on it. if it doesnt bow at all then thats great! if it does then i would put the trim back on.
if it does not bow consider moving the glass brace. if you do then test it for the same thing. if it still doesnt bow then you should be good to go. if it does bow then go back and resilicone the glass piece back and go from there.
i would call a company who makes rimless tanks and ask them about a tank of your size. dont say you already have a tank just say you are interested in say a 48x24x24 tank and you were just wondering how thick the glass on that would have to be to keep it rimless.
that might give you a little more piece of mind if they say oh we can do it out of 1/4" non tempered compared to your thinking of example 1/2" tempered ya know.
keep the glass brace and remove the trim. finish the edges then fill it all the way to the very top. double check it for how square it is. you can do this by either using a level or a piece of string. take the string and put it at the very outer tip of one side and the very outer tip at the other size and let the line sit on top of the tank glass and see if there are any visible arches/bows in the glass. the string will help you picture a straight line compared to one with a load on it. if it doesnt bow at all then thats great! if it does then i would put the trim back on.
if it does not bow consider moving the glass brace. if you do then test it for the same thing. if it still doesnt bow then you should be good to go. if it does bow then go back and resilicone the glass piece back and go from there.
i would call a company who makes rimless tanks and ask them about a tank of your size. dont say you already have a tank just say you are interested in say a 48x24x24 tank and you were just wondering how thick the glass on that would have to be to keep it rimless.
that might give you a little more piece of mind if they say oh we can do it out of 1/4" non tempered compared to your thinking of example 1/2" tempered ya know.
Great advise on testing the tank, thanks. I emailed Great Lakes Aquariums before I created this thread and asked about glass thickness for their 48x18x24 rimless tanks. They use 3/8" glass. So, I'm less concerned about the glass and more concerned about the silicone. I need to go measure the trim as I think this may influence peoples thoughts.
Great advise on testing the tank, thanks. I emailed Great Lakes Aquariums before I created this thread and asked about glass thickness for their 48x18x24 rimless tanks. They use 3/8" glass. So, I'm less concerned about the glass and more concerned about the silicone. I need to go measure the trim as I think this may influence peoples thoughts.
silicone should least a longg time unless it rots meaning something got in there and ate or or bacteria got on it and ate it or some chemicals deteriorated it. usually in any tank you get a leak because 1 the glass bowed out, 2 you hit it with a scraper, 3 something in your tank hit the seal or a snail/worm/whatever got into and dug behind it, 4 it was never sealed properly to begin with and was holding tight due to pressure on the silicone causing the seal.
take your time with it. remember this hobby = patience.
silicone should least a longg time unless it rots meaning something got in there and ate or or bacteria got on it and ate it or some chemicals deteriorated it. usually in any tank you get a leak because 1 the glass bowed out, 2 you hit it with a scraper, 3 something in your tank hit the seal or a snail/worm/whatever got into and dug behind it, 4 it was never sealed properly to begin with and was holding tight due to pressure on the silicone causing the seal.
take your time with it. remember this hobby = patience.
Good to know about the silicone. And as for patience... I've had the tank in storage for SEVENTEEN YEARS and my reef was going back then... believe me I know patience
Removing top trim to go rimless?
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Originally Posted by CalmSeasQuest
