lineage and names?

[MUCHO REEF]

Come on now Bro. I kept my replies serious. I know you can do better than that. I gave the cold hard facts to each of your replies. None of the reasons holds any water. Again, I'm a reefer, my concern has never been about someone's profits at a swap or as a reefer, the hobby comes first. Lets just end with we respectfully agree to disagree, shake hands, and now.....now we can sing Kumbaya!.


Thanks Bro

[schminksbro]

That's cool Mucho, but my plan would work. Gotta go for the night.

Come on now Bro. I kept my replies serious. I know you can do better than that. I gave the cold hard facts to each of your replies. None of the reasons holds any water. Again, I'm a reefer, my concern has never been about someone's profits at a swap or as a reefer, the hobby comes first. Lets just end with we respectfully agree to disagree, shake hands, and now.....now we can sing Kumbaya!.


Thanks Bro

[jimsflies]

Hey Mucho... I was asked by one of my reefing buddies that you stop using the term "skyhigh" prices. Which is a fair request I think...after all we aren't calling them "mucho" prices.

[Sharkboy87]

Mucho is right in saying that these colors didnt pop up over night. I remember what used to be sold in the LFS... I bagged em up, or bought them myself. Speckled, solid, multi, green, pink, red, yellow, orange, brown, occationally blue. AND THEY WERE COLONIES FOR $30!!! The ONLY zoanthid or playthoa color morph that can even slightly be considered HIGHLY RARE would be crazy blues. Frankly I havent seen alot of the really nice blues in years, possibly because people hoard them. Most people dont want them to go on ebay and go for $1000 a polyp.

[Sharkboy87]

Hey Mucho... I was asked by one of my reefing buddies that you stop using the term "skyhigh" prices. Which is a fair request I think...after all we aren't calling them "mucho" prices.

Perhaps it can be changed to sky-high prices, or prices as high as the sky. After all thats what they are.

[Wy Renegade]

This hobby is very difficult to make money in. The get rich quick guys learn that very quickly. The price of polyps drops so quickly that you will end in in a perpetual state of reinvestment. I have said before that is is a good method to build a coral collection but not a good way to make any substantial money.

Andy, you have hit the nail on the head. It is not a good way to make any substantial money, at least not quickly. Unfortunately, too many believe that it is . . . they get in, they grab up some colonies for cheap, chop em up, offer them up for sale, make a little money, maybe reinvest in some other frags thinking they're going to grow them out, chop them up, and sell them as well (because they are high dollar, they think they can make even more money off of them, so they help to drive up the high prices). Then they hit the hard, tall stone wall of reality; their polyps don't grow fast enough or they start dying because they didn't really bother to find out what they needed to do to keep them alive. So what do they do? They either let them die off (cause they can't sell them anymore), pack up their tank sell it off and get out of the hobby (so their involvement helped neither the prices nor the hobby), or they bundle up their now enormous collection of high priced stuff and sell it off a very large price to someone else who doesn't know any better and thinks they are getting a instant premium collection), and they take their money and move on to the next set/type of corals which they also know nothing about, but which are selling for even higher prices, and therefore they should be able to make even more money . . .

Helps out the hobby? Helps out the coral? Helps out the people collecting corals out of the ocean? I don't think so . . .

Helps out the prices? Absolutely!

I just don't see the anger at a hobbyist that makes a few hundred or even a couple thousand a year selling frags. It seems kind of petty and I have much better things to worry about.

Where do you get that I am angry at hobbyists? I'm not angry, to my knowledge I've never once said that I'm angry or used the word mad. I've used the word "sad" over and over again, that doesn't make me angry. I know a lot of great people that are out there in this hobby that make money off their tanks. As I've said multiple times before in this thread, I have absolutely no problem with that. Zip, zero, none, nada! I have no problem with businesses that make a fair profit margin. My parents are in retail, I know exactly what it takes to run a business and make it work. I also know that if all those businesses in the real world tried to make even a 100% profit on what they spent on what they are retailing, they would be out of business overnight. Why do we think its ok for an individual or a business to do so in this hobby?

[Wy Renegade]

Ive got a flip of the coin too....going to save this one for later though......its got EVERYTHING to do with named corals, and small frags.......might be an eye opener.

Stay tuned.

Waiting . . .

I'll admit I haven't read all of this thread but to add my "2 cents"...

If and when those two items align - a sale takes place. It's that simple. It seems to me that in some ways, this thread is much about finding ways to protect us from ourselves

Like Jim, I'm not going to quote the whole thing. I think that this was well said. The part I disagree with it that its about protecting us from ourselves. Its really about protecting ourselves from the high prices caused by the actions of "Junior Polyp Pimper" (sorry mooch, but I had to steal this one) and his buddies (be they hobbiests or be they a business).

As far as my statement on the premature mortality of many of these corals, I will say this. Yes, corals can die on anyone, but I would give them a better shot at longevity with an experience reefer who places the corals first, over Junior Polyp Pimper who purchased his first tank Monday, and is now trying to grow corals in it on Friday.

Mucho Reef

ROFL; mooch, I love that one . . . if you don't mind, I'll use it from here on out. I believe it more clearly identifies who we are talking about.

Hey Mucho... I was asked by one of my reefing buddies that you stop using the term "skyhigh" prices. Which is a fair request I think...after all we aren't calling them "mucho" prices.

ROFL; I wonder who that would be . . . (For clarities sake Skyhigh - no slam intended - it just tickled my funny bone, cause I hadn't even thought about it till Jim said something).

Mucho is right in saying that these colors didnt pop up over night. I remember what used to be sold in the LFS... I bagged em up, or bought them myself. Speckled, solid, multi, green, pink, red, yellow, orange, brown, occationally blue. AND THEY WERE COLONIES FOR $30!!! The ONLY zoanthid or playthoa color morph that can even slightly be considered HIGHLY RARE would be crazy blues. Frankly I havent seen alot of the really nice blues in years, possibly because people hoard them. Most people dont want them to go on ebay and go for $1000 a polyp.

But isn't this also contributing to the problem? If people sit on them and hoard them and keep them away from the general public, what happens when someone lets some out and they "suddenly appear on the market?"

[MUCHO REEF]

Hey Mucho... I was asked by one of my reefing buddies that you stop using the term "skyhigh" prices. Which is a fair request I think...after all we aren't calling them "mucho" prices.

Is this a joke. These prices are high. Yes, they are also MUCHO HIGH, I'd agree with that 100%.

[jimsflies]

Is this a joke. These prices are high. Yes, they are also MUCHO HIGH, I'd agree with that 100%.

No he's tired of seeing his name in this thread. Can't say I blame him.

[MUCHO REEF]

Please PM me as I have no idea what you're talking about here